“We’re All In This Together”: Richard O’Brien’s Message For The Madness Of Our Times

The man who penned the picture show candidly converses with YOUR EX’s Oliver Hall about AI, inclusion, Trump and the enduring magic of Rocky Horror.

When I finally reach Richard O’Brien over Zoom and apologise for being late, he brushes it off with a wicked grin.

“Don’t worry. It allowed me to go out on the front porch again and have another glass of red. It may affect our interview; we’ll see how that goes,” he winks.

It is the most Richard O’Brien welcome imaginable – mischievous, theatrical and warm all at once.

We last spoke around five years ago, and I ask how the intervening years have treated him. He sighs, then laughs under his breath.

“I’ve been waking up every day and googling Trump. These last few days, with this change, have uplifted me. It’s been heartening.”

He is referring to recent political shifts in the United States, suggesting Trump may be losing support. “We mustn’t think this guarantees change coming. It’s very difficult while this madman is in his position. Rationality has been abandoned. The whole world has been sitting on the edge of its seat.”

Yet he admits there has been relief in seeing what he calls “sanity coming back into the room.” Richard’s political rage has always sat beside a deep, tender concern for humanity. He is never cynical for cynicism’s sake.

On Trump himself, he is characteristically unsparing:

“It’s astonishing, isn’t it? If you stood in front of Trump and said to him, ‘Your agenda is dog-eat-dog and you’re top dog,’ he’d probably say, ‘What took you so long?’”

He says he and Trump have never crossed paths but points out a Rocky Horror co-star who has.

“Poor Tim Curry did during filming for Home Alone 2. He had to stay in Trump Tower. One of Trump’s wives asked him, ‘How’s the room?’ Tim told me, ‘It’s awful. Everything’s gold and horrible.’”

As Aotearoa moves toward its own election year, Richard shares his hopes for this country.

“Unity,” he says instantly.

“The whole world needs unity above all. Divisiveness is encouraged by right-wing authoritarians. They always divide, demonise and separate us.”

He raises an example from the past: Auckland Pride’s decision to exclude police officers in uniform from marching.

“That was a silly mistake. It was essential the police were there in uniform to say ‘We support you’ and to be visible.”

This leads him to recall speaking to a group of gay men decades ago in London.

“They were big bearded men, dressed like lumberjacks, and they were being unkind to ‘sissy queens’. I asked them: ‘If we want the world to accept us, why are you excluding people who are more feminine?’ They couldn’t answer. The rainbow banner should be about inclusion.”

It’s not only queer people Richard wants to see unite.

“With AI coming along, a lot of people who are anti-welfare will find themselves needing benefits because AI is going to take away a lot of jobs. We’re all in it together. We need to look after each other rather than divide.”

As a creative, Richard’s assessment of AI is grave.

“It’s terrifying. A sci-fi reality. We’re living in extraordinary times. We have quantum AI technology, and at the same time we still have hunter-gatherers on this planet. We’re all getting left behind.”

Richard blames the world’s woes on one thing – what he calls ‘Abrahamic creative myth fantasy’, namely Christianity, Islam and Judaism.

“It’s messed us up. Seventy-five per cent of the planet prefers magic to rationality. Most disapproval towards the gay community comes from that medieval worldview.”

He rolls his eyes at one familiar local figure. “Look at Brian Tamaki. What a childish man. He said two gay men having sex with a happy ending makes God send a tidal wave. It’s inane… And those leathers! Very Tom of Finland.”

With the mood lightened, he reflects on the greatest time of his life: the 1960s.

“I arrived in England in ’64 for a working holiday, and in ’65 I was in London. I couldn’t have been in a better place. I started riding horses in films like Carry On Cowboy. England swung like a pendulum. It was a wonderful decade. I smoked my first jazz cigarette [a joint] in Mick Jagger’s front room.”

He laughs. “If you can remember the 60s, you weren’t there.”

Of course, no conversation with Richard is complete without talking about The Rocky Horror Show, which will tour Aotearoa with the award-winning international production that thrilled the West End.

He claims to be confused by the show’s longevity when so many musicals have fallen by the wayside. He credits Tim Curry’s iconic movie performance for part of that endurance.

“Frank-N-Furter sits alongside Cruella de Vil as one of cinema’s most memorable visual characters.”

But the bigger reason, he says, is community.

“It’s a rainbow event. It’s allowed marginalised people to come together and feel safe and laugh. It’s a childish piece of theatre – delightfully childish. But it’s a gathering point. That’s the happiest ending for me. Hearing them laugh, tap their feet, and knowing it brings people together.”

Over the years, Rocky Horror Show has brought over 35 million theatre-goers together. It has toured 20 countries and been translated into 20 languages. Richard believes some of that success stems from it being a tale as old as time.

“Brad and Janet are Adam and Eve. Frank-N-Furter is the serpent. It’s Hansel and Gretel. It’s pubescence. Brad and Janet are discovering sexuality. That familiarity is there before the curtain even goes up. And it ends with society being reassured again. Safe. Satisfied.”

Before we finish, I ask whether he has seen the Sabrina Carpenter chart-topping Tears video that pays tribute to Rocky. He laughs.

“No. But if things like that needed our sign-off, we’d never have been able to make our movie. Look at what we stole. Frankenstein. Excuse me.”

He pauses, almost kindly.

“You’re allowed to steal. The only rule is you must improve on what you stole from. Nothing is formed in a vacuum.”

As we say goodbye, he adds, “I’ve been getting a bit tiddly here. Your fault.”

He is entirely lucid, entirely charming and entirely Richard – philosopher, provocateur and the queer uncle we all wish we had.

Next year, as Rocky Horror Show tours New Zealand again, Richard’s call for unity feels particularly poignant. In a world of shifting politics, rising AI and old myths clinging to new lives, his message is simple: we’re all in it together. And perhaps that’s why his creation still matters. It gives us a room to gather in, to laugh in and to celebrate our differences; not be afraid of them.