YOUR EX’s Oliver Hall speaks to Arani Cuthbert, the Topp Twins’ long-time manager, about Dame Jools Topp’s generosity, courage, politics, and the quiet life behind one of Aotearoa’s most beloved public figures.
For more than four decades, Dame Jools Topp helped Aotearoa see itself differently: funnier, kinder, more rural, more political and more proudly queer. Alongside her twin sister, Dame Lynda Topp, Jools turned country music, character comedy and unapologetic lesbian visibility into something deeply and unmistakably Kiwi. Following Jools’ death from breast cancer at 68, Arani Cuthbert sat down with YOUR EX to pay tribute to Jools.
WHAT ARE YOUR FONDEST MEMORIES OF MANAGING THE TOPP TWINS?
They were, in a way, the antithesis of the celebrity personality. They certainly didn’t want the lifestyle that you see on social media today. They had all this talent. They could connect with audiences anywhere. They went across just as well overseas, even in places like the Old Time Country Music Festival in Iowa.
That was an incredible experience because it was heartland Midwest, and a lot of the older audience members actually thought they were boys. It was a competition festival, and they won first prize for yodelling and for country comedy! We managed to escape without people realising they were actually women. It was bizarre.
WHAT DID YOU MOST ADMIRE ABOUT JOOLS?
Her honesty, generosity and kindness.
She was a huge animal lover. She always had a house full of animals, and that has been heartbreaking, seeing her animals mourn her.
And her courage. She was obviously proud to be a lesbian, and they helped me come out. My earliest memory of the Topp Twins was, like many people in Auckland, seeing them busking in Queen Street. Their song ‘Paradise’ certainly helped many women of my generation to ‘cross the road’ and accept who they were in terms of their sexuality.
It was such a celebration of women’s music that the twins were part of. There were other amazing female artists and bands too, so it was a very exciting time to be a young lesbian in Auckland.
MOST OF OUR READERS WILL HAVE SEEN JOOLS’ STAGE AND SCREEN PERSONAS, BUT WAS THERE ANYTHING ABOUT JOOLS BEHIND THE SCENES THAT MIGHT SURPRISE THEM?
She was a real homebody. She loved being at home on her farm with her animals. That was her happy place.
Much to my frustration at times, she turned down exciting international opportunities to remain in New Zealand. That was hard as their manager because I could see how far they could go.
WERE THOSE OPPORTUNITIES THAT WOULD HAVE INVOLVED LIVING OVERSEAS?
Yes.
Jools, more than Lynda, always wanted to come home. I look back on it, and I remember thinking, “This is what keeps her going.” It probably contributed to how enduring their career was, that they did have time to replenish.
Jools was true to herself. People often say, “I need to find out who I am and what makes me happy,” and that is often quite a big challenge for people. It wasn’t for Jools. She knew who she was. She knew what made her happy, and when she did those things, she was completely in the moment, especially when performing.
And what they were doing through their music and comedy was really changing people’s hearts and minds, and that was quite something to witness back then.
WE’RE IN AN ELECTION YEAR THAT IS ALSO THE 40TH ANNIVERSARY OF HOMOSEXUAL LAW REFORM. IS THERE ANYTHING YOU THINK JOOLS WOULD WANT PEOPLE TO HAVE FRONT OF MIND NOW?
It’s a real shame, because the world needs, and New Zealand in particular needs, the Topp Twins now just as much as we did back in the ’80s and ’90s. If her health had allowed, she would have been a lot more politically active recently.
The twins have always supported the Labour Party, way back through the Helen Clark years, and of course, Jacinda bought their caravan for her campaign. I know they felt that it was very sad and shocking how Jacinda has been treated, and what has happened to this country since Covid.
It feels like the response to Jacinda has unmasked an unfortunate deep schism of misogyny and selfishness. Under the very extreme form of capitalism we’re all living under now, there are a lot of hurt, disenfranchised people all wanting to blame somebody.
That’s why I still come back to what the twins did in their live performances as being so radical. They did not falter from putting their message across, but they did it in a way that was not bombastic at all. It was wrapped up with very clever comedy and music that mainstream audiences responded to.
IS THERE ANYTHING YOU WOULD LIKE RAINBOW NEW ZEALANDERS, IN PARTICULAR, TO REMEMBER ABOUT JOOLS?
Our Rainbow community has become quite divisive too. I can’t put words in Jools’ mouth, but I know that didn’t make her happy.
We are all different, and we just have to celebrate those differences. We’re living through times where people seem to be dividing one another. Identity politics has become so loaded.
What really matters is that we’re tolerant and kind. We should celebrate our humanity and not be so judgemental.
IS THERE ANYTHING ABOUT HER RELATIONSHIP WITH LYNDA THAT YOU THINK WOULD SURPRISE OUR READERS?
A twin relationship is like no other sibling relationship. They were just so bonded.
In the last 15 years or so, they lived separately for the first time in their lives. But in the last year and a half, they lived back together again, with Lynda being Jools’ caregiver. Lynda was amazing. She really stepped up as a brilliant nurse and cared for Jools at home, right to the end.
IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE YOU WOULD LIKE OUR READERS TO REMEMBER?
Their generosity.
There was a very big heart there. They always helped people who didn’t have very much, in a way that they didn’t get accolades for.
In the early days, when we were touring, they liked to befriend hitchhikers, who were usually broke travellers. They would always take them out for a meal or give them some cash along the way.
It was that very simple generosity that wasn’t about trumpeting their own goodness. It was just low-key.
They weren’t just incredible entertainers. They were really great people with great values. It’s that value set, and the love they had for this country, that audiences responded to.
Sure, they were brilliant singer-songwriters and comedians, but behind that there was an energy like no other. For me, that energy was pure joy and love. That’s why we’re all mourning this loss, because those are pretty rare commodities, really.
